Good choices are the Lionel 32923 Accessory Transformer, or another 80-watt transformer like the one included in your set, #14198. Again, an independent power supply and distribution bus is a good idea for your switches. Sell Your Trains To A Train Dealer or a Single Buyer. Sign up for new product releases, promotions, and more. The least expensive power supply you should consider is the Lionel CW80 Transformer; you can buy a new one for about $150 or a used on one eBay for about $60. Some people even find it fun. These are all good, dependable transformers from the postwar era that are easy to find today, have adequate wattages ranging from 90-270 watts, have a circuit breaker for safety and have a whistle controller. how much track can a transformer handle? | Model Train Forum The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. One rail is positive, the other negative. New trains; old transformers | Classic Toy Trains Magazine DCS Power Supplies | MTH ELECTRIC TRAINS A solid and stranded wire of the same gauge will be the same total diameter. Come join the discussion about brands, various scales, repairs, storage, displays, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! (Electrical Contractor with dear old Dad for 30 years) Regards Steve. As time goes on you can add higher wattage bricks one by one. But after a little while, you will likely want your train to do more, and youll start thinking along these lines: --It sure would be neat if it did more than run in a circle. PDF Lionel CW-80 Transformer Owner's Manual - thomconte.com The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. This is because the demands for power are becoming more than your transformer can handle. Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80. I suggest that you proactively lay an 10-2 AWG NM cable (or at least 12-2) along the track and tap into it as needed to keep the voltage up. The transformer included with your starter set should be adequate to handle a modest expansion of your train set discussed above. Are you looking for a product or serviceif so, then read this BEFORE you post! Outdoor railroads are, of course, an exception! Model Train Track & Transformer at Lionel Trains These transformers are much cheaper than they were even just a few years ago, but that just makes them a bigger bargain today. 24v, 120v, 208v, 240v, 480v, and 600v). Adding more freight or passenger cars [also known as rolling stock] to your set is another way to quickly expand your railroad. Transformer for Lionel that works in AUSTRALIA Our community is FREE to join. For safety reasons, the batteries were soon replaced by a 110 volt transformer. The larger transformers could operate up to four trains independently. I have a 3amp, 40watt transformer. The 1033 is not the same as the 1044. Some of the variables are obvious, others not so much. When you block a person, they can no longer invite you to a private message or post to your profile wall. Find 500+ popular train rides, museums, and railroad vacation destinations in the U.S and Canada! You have pretty much pointed up the major problem, everything is different. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. Ive talked more about the KW here. Amperes = VA/Secondary Volts or 40VA/28V = 1.43 amperes. The Lionel Multi-control 1033 is a 90 watt transformer produced from 1948 to 1956. Willoughby, Ohio - the home of the CP & E RR. Any of the below transformers from M.T.H. The motor takes electricity through a small wire attached to a metal wheel that rests on the middle rail underneath. This is a old school approach for sizing cables & transformers or appliances in the electrical trade, & has never let us down. All of the transformers that have more than 90 Watts are in great demand today as more collectors are operating retro-layouts. Sell Your Trains Using a Live Auction House. "What size wire should I use?" http://www.lccuk.org.uk/lccuk Regards Nick Save Reply Quote N Nick12DMC Registered JavaScript is disabled. If you're looking to only have one loop with multiple sidings then you'll only need 1 source of power for the whole layout. Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, Calculating transformer size for layout size. While those locomotives and their sound systems are designed to operate using conventional transformers like your ZW, digital controllers are needed to activate additional features like special sound effects and coupler activation. 12V DC to 120V AC 60Hz pure sine inverter. Keep the power supplies in an area where they get plenty of air circulation to prevent overheating. This would be more than enough for any single train and a few accessories. Power Conversion for Lionel Trains and O-Gauge - KCC Scientific View More! As far as new transformers go, someone else may be able to help more than I can. A model railroad train set designed for use in the United States will have a 115V AC 60Hz power requirement. All power supplies will be rated for volts, amps, and watts. $2799. Scale cars almost always have the number 7 as the second digit in their number [17623, 27241, etc]. Trainz carries a variety of books that build upon the information listed above. Are you running command or conventional? Serving these devices with their own dedicated supply will not only allow you to supply them with a proper constant voltage, but it will also free your main power supply to handle the load of the train itself. As you can see, a lot of great helpers here. If you like, tell us more about yourself. American Flyer Trains were made in several gauges. Lionel 1033 Transformer Renovation Part I - YouTube Turn on the throttle, then short the A and U posts (in the case of Lionel) or variable and base posts (in the case of Flyer) with a screwdriver or a piece of wire for a maximum of five seconds. Although it will not have any impact on the performance of the wire within, choosing multiple colors of wire, and standardizing on a specific color for each function, will go a long way in making your wiring easier to install and easier to detect flaws later on. It would be advantageous if OGR magazine would put an article together comparing the major manufacturers transformers output waveform compatibility/ incompatibilitywith the various manufacturer's locomotives - Atlas O, Weaver, 3rd Rail, MTH , Lionel etc and conventional , DCS , TMCC, Legacy command control. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. You may never use all the amps, but it's usually cheaper to grow into a power supply than to continually upgrade. Transformer sizing for new systems converting a 2-rail freight car to 2-rail with Atlas trucks, My Triple Level Layout -FREEBIE UPDATE- 3/2/23, Successful Open House Upstate (NY) Model Railroaders, FS: Lionel MPC and modern traditional size rolling stock. Safety first. I got a lot of lightweight transformers that came with starter sets over the years. Use the CW-80 Transformer only for its intended purpose. This drawing illustrates all of the key functionality of a Lionel KW transformer. But it is important to take a close look at the cars to make sure that they are a good match for your set. I'm sure I'll need more help along the way, so I'll be checking back in with more silly questions! --I wish I had some more cars to put behind the engine. A Passenger consist can easily use more power than the engine. This works for command control layouts too, since those parked trains are still drawing some current. Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Best Selling Lionel 1908080 O Gauge CW80 Transformers - Black (4) $147.85 New $110.00 Used Lionel Legacy Powermaster Lnl637146 (13) $134.99 New $90.00 Used Lionel 634120 TMCC Direct Lock-On Transformer - Silver (21) $58.99 New $49.99 Used You can't count on a lack of compatibility issues for one Legacy locomotive being definitive for all Legacy locomotives, for example. A starter set is the best way to start with the train hobby. In three-rail systems, the outer rails are both grounded, and the center rail is "hot.". There are a few standards when it comes to the color-coding. Lots of good tips for building a layout from two of the most experienced people in the hobby. The CW-80 Transformer was meant to operate on 120-volt, 60-Hertz power. So far, I haven't seen any way to do this except to take amp measurements or just wing it and see how hot your transformer gets. I can remember a time when a Lionel ZW would set you back $275. Doug Murphy 'We few, we happy few, we band of brothers' Henry V. I am a person with a very active inner child. Why Do Lionel Trains Have 3 Rails? | Worldwide Rails Price Received. There isn't a one-size-fits-all solution, so you'll need to consider what you want to do and measure your options accordingly. If you want a spur track to store an extra car or two, Lionel makes another expansion set [#12044] that does just that: Note that this set includes one switch which is the track section that makes the track diverge onto two separate routes. Just like with your track bus and feeders, running an accessory bus of slightly heavier wire to connect to each light or accessory with a smaller feeder is a good plan. My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? I have noticed that my old transformers do not work well or not work at all with newer electronic whistle tenders. "O" Gauge is what Lionel is today, along with "O27". When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Although not necessarily a mandated standard, white, black and or red are used for track power on most layouts - if for no other reason than these colors are easiest to find. It is important to remember that the real test of the power supply is the load you'll place on it. Transformer Size Calculator - Electram Kind Regards Steve, QUOTE: by Dave Has anyone here ever blown a transformer from hauling a double-headed Allegheny coal drag up a 2 percent grade?. If the voltage drop in the track is more than a small fraction of the transformer voltage, that is, a volt or two, you are going to have trouble running the trains anyway. its the amount of engines you need to worry about, I'm currently running my entire layout on a single DC power supply that came with an Athearn engine/track set. A while back, approximately 2 weeks ago while running two very lengthy loops of fast track an old transformer nearly fried (50 years old) one of my wires that I was running to my Fastrac. If youre buying a transformer, youll be able to easily find one that a professional refurbished and upgraded with the links I provide below. He directs production at Lionel, the premier model train manufacturer, and he istheformer president of theConrail HistoricalSociety. If you like fixing things, fixing an old transformer is rewarding. Getting Started - 3 RAIL TRAINS How do you choose the right power supply for your model trains? The transformer, when operated at the lower frequency, may . Handbook of layout wiring | Classic Toy Trains Magazine In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. properly wired transformer can handle any amount of track. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. Likewise, if you only want to run one train at a time, you can keep other trains on the track by wiring with blocks, and turning off trains that are not in use. As an example, look at these two cars closely: While both are gondola cars and run on O Gauge track, note how the car on the left is much longer than the one on the right. Well Mike what I am about to suggest may be a little pricy or at least it was for me but I have managed to buy a new Lionel ZW. In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. Over the years I have collected boxed (mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. :-). The Atlas and Bachmann 80 watt transformers, they are one and the same, can be had for around $75.00. I am currently running about 40 bulbs, which at 0.1 A each total 4 amps! Past,presentand future. However, if you begin to add lighted cars, or more than a couple accessories, you may find that your train will not run as fast, or that it will shut off entirely. It also has an optional bell sound that can be turned on and off. Not wanting to give up, I experimented with an 80 watt modern Lionel transformer and got great results. Mark. Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. You don't really need a diagram -- you want to pick your interval (some would recommend as often as 3'), drill a hole down through your base, and connect a wire to a bus which runs beneath the layout and connects to your transformer (obviously, you need two wires, one for each powered rail). This is why my wife loves me so. Solid wire is preferable as it is much easier to solder to the rails. The whistle requires more power than the outfits that don't have it. Professionals Need: Kindle Direct Publishing Indie Digital & Print Publishing Made Easy Amazon Photos Unlimited Photo Storage Free With Prime: Prime Video Direct If you need a device that converts from different voltages so it can power another device, then a transformer will fulfill that role perfectly. Faq No: 1029 The Lionel 1033 can be used for small or medium-sized layouts. I know this has nothing to do with Mike's original problem but is more of a reflection on Trainman's reply. It does not work with O27. The CW-80 is a nice little transformer, has accessory output as well,but as you have stated you will outgrow the CW-80 pretty quick. I've got around 320 ft of track between all of the mainline, sidings, etc and I don't have any problems running my engines anywhere on the layout. Its a bargain at that price. We use a ZW 275 and a KW on this, so 405 watts. Price Received. Many manufacturers assemble cases with special screws to prevent access to the inside and accidental shock. As your layout grows beyond the basic oval of track that comes with most starter sets, a good power distribution network is essential to getting consistent performance from your train all the way around. Everything you need to get going is included, its reliable, and setup is usually very easy. Most two-rail track systems use direct current (DC). Over the years I have collected boxed(mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. They are known as HO train sets because they are half the size of O-guage. Another classic is the Automatic Gateman. Some great beginner accessories are the #12052 Fastrack Highway Signal set, which is a set of highway signals that blink as the train goes by. HO trains are very durable and are made with high quality parts and pieces to ensure the longevity of the Lionel train brand! Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. A. My question is this in order that this doesn't happen again what type of transformer would you recommend? What size Lionel transformer do I need? - Tracks-movie.com In some cases. I thought you wanted information related to your layout not operations at a trains show. The 110-wattLionel RW is a cheap option, and the 125-watt LW, while a bit more expensive, gives a bit more power. Amazon.com: Lionel O Gauge Transformer You don't want to try to solder even Number 16 gauge wire right to your rails, however. As your layout grows so, too, will its power demand. They run on O Gauge track, but they are not exact O Scale cars. There are many advantages in repairing or reconditioning your transformers. Sign-up for email today! The choice of a control system is somewhat, but not necessarily, dependent on which manufacturers engines you prefer or have the most of. Wow.thanks for all the advice so far, guys!! Do not use this device if water is present. That said, if youre uncomfortable fixing a transformer, I wont look down on you for buying one someone else fixed up. With the ever-increasing amount of small electronics in today's sophisticated models, this protection is more important than ever. Yes, but the train will probably run too fast, depending on the output voltage of the transformer. Most command systems use a constant AC power supply, and trains are controlled by impulses sent through the rails. CW80 Transformer. Not really a how-to-build-a-layout book, but it is a good general introduction to the hobby full of interesting stuff. They are reasonably durable and were popular in their day, which means there are still a lot of them floating around so they tend to be inexpensive. This has the added advantage that Lionel TMCC (command control) will operate correctly. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-wattLionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. They give a true 180 watts and have excellent electronic breakers. Fortunately, there is an easy way to tell these cars apart, and the key is the numbers Lionel assigns to them. Expanding Your Lionel Starter Set - Trainz I have a post war ZW and a KW and a Z, all three are good transformers, just meant for differant needs. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. This thing has more power then I will ever need. You can also minimize voltage drop at the rail joints by soldering the rails together. UpBright 18V AC/DC Adapter Compatible with Lionel O Gauge Fastrack 10" Remote Control Terminal Straight LionChief System Track 6-1923100 HKYF45-180230T-US DC18V 2300mA 18VDC Power Supply Cord Charger. The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. If you have time, check out the "Coffee Pot". The good news is, Lionel made a lot of good transformers over the years. (using 4 of the 180 watt Lionel bricks) That's 10 amps per channel on all 4 channels. Twin coil machines have a higher current draw when in motion but are also much faster-acting than the motorized versions. The same is true for other electronic projects around your layout and inside buildings, train cars, and even locomotives. And of course, individual Fastrack sections are also available. Remember, the only silly question is the one that you did not ask. I run an MTH 4-6-2 PS-1 pulling five Madisons on about fifty feet of track and the transformer I am using (Z-4000) has a digital amp readout. Like tankist stated.It's only running multiple engines that I run into issues. As your needs grow, you can employ a larger transformer of fixed voltage. Classic Toy Trains magazine offers information about toy trains operating and collecting, toy train product news and reviews, toy train layout tips, toy train layout designs and track plans, and more. 4.1 4.1 out of 5 stars (15) Ages: 14 years and up. This means that they are not exact 1:48 replicas of the real thing but instead are selectively compressed to negotiate the tight turns of regular Lionel track. If this happens, you will need another transformer to share the load. This is where the Lionel transformer comparisons should begin. Anyway if it takes me 100 years to finish this thing one thing is for sure I will not have to worry about powering anything and everything. While better starter sets usually include a more robust transformer, as a general rule the power pack supplied with your starter set is just thata start. Daniel Defense firearms, parts and accessories, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=9670, http://www.modeltrainforum.com/album.php?u=2334, 14X16 Switching style [url]http://www.modeltrainforum.com/showthread.php?t=8241, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkMHvbckuBLo3pJN1FGE1Gg. Whatever colors and pattern you choose, just make sure to keep a good notebook handy to reference later. Been there, done that. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. Take the hint. To participate you must either login or register for an account. But a 12-gauge solid wire is one strand, while a 12-gauge stranded wire may be made up of more than a dozen much smaller individual strands spun together. Interested in southest Pennsylvania railroads; The 190-wattLionel KWwas the second biggest and second best transformer of the postwar era. The first Lionel electric trains were powered by wet-cell batteries, which were, of course, dangerous. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. Ran 6 motors [MPC's]. I know my train club had an issue with conventional locomotives not running properly on a layout with DCS and TMCC and apparently solved it by replacing a Lionel transformer with an MRC transformer that puts out a pure sine wave. The power supply that comes with these sets is usually a very small wall pack plug-in that cannot be easily expanded. That transformer will only prolly handle 1 engine and depending on how long it is will depend on how many extra feeders you will need around the layout. Just get a Lionel #12053 Accessory wire set and enough extra wire to connect from the wire set back to your transformer [speaker wire works well]. The Lionel RW also happens to be a great transformer for Marx or American Flyer trains too, when you connect the track leads to the B and U posts instead of the A and U posts youd normally use for most Lionel setups. It is much easier to be ready ahead of time then to have to do some changes afterwards. Use this index to see additional details about the individual transformers issued by Lionel during the post-war period. A locomotive on a mile-long loop will draw as many amps as it does on a 4x8 platform. It's expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. Lionel has a new 180 watt transformer due out soon that will be a nice upgrade. The Best Technical and Innovative Podcasts you should Listen, Essay Writing Service: The Best Solution for Busy Students, 6 The Best Alternatives for WhatsApp for Android, The Best Solar Street Light Manufacturers Across the World, Ultimate packing list while travelling with your dog. Lionel Trains Pocket Price Guide 1901-2022. The Lionel Track & Power catalog is BACK with the latest information for more ways to make your layout even bigger, better and more powerful! EXPLORE FasTrack 10" Straight Track 4-Pack 6-12032 $ 21.99 FasTrack Grade Crossing with Flashers 6-12052 $ 99.99 FasTrack O36 Curved Track 4-Pack 6-12033 $ 21.99 Legacy AMC-2 Motor Controller I paid $75 + shipping for mine a year ago. Retrofitting a subway line into existing benchwork - and are subway sets still being made? Lionel Trains|MTH Train|Lionel Train Sets| HO model Trains| G Scale|Dept 56 That it not to say that there are not engineering formulae to calculate the current draw and thus the wattage, but far and away the easiest method is to measure it. The 1044 is just a 1033 in a . There have been issues with chopped waveform transformers, i.e. Both are lighted. The article you suggest would be a daunting task, as you'd have to gather virtually every known locomotive and transformer! If you are using only LEDs for lighting, you could get away with even less. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Big Ed Railroad Tycoon $7.89 delivery Feb 2 - 6. This will spread the load of your lighted passenger consist across the two transformers. What size Lionel transformer do I need? Effort. DCC is less common in starter sets, but some are available. If you have to ask,your needs are a lot more modest than that. Calculating transformer size for layout size - Classic Toy - Trains Used a 1033 for accessories and lights. This means that you will have about.5 volt drop if your train draws 5 amperes. What is the best transformer to use? - O Gauge Railroading On Line Forum First, a few general notes about choosing wire. That might work, but it's probably borderline, especially if you are using something like a 1033 transformer that tops out at 16 volts. Never Enough Room, Time or Money for all the Trains! While most of the American Flyer products are re-issues using old Gilbert tooling from the 1950s, the O scale equipment is a combination of new designs and reissues. --Heck, watching one train run is great, Ill bet TWO would be even more fun! I have since wired the new transformer to my layout along with the old ZW. Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. To determine the maximum transformer current, divide the transformer VA by transformer secondary voltage. And of course, Lionel also makes lots of figures to populate your town. Steve's rule of thumb for derating is very close to and in the same spirit as the NEC rule that an appliance may not draw more than 80 percent of the current rating of the outlet. If you want a station for your trains to stop at, there are both station platforms [#24159] as well as full sized stations [#14257]. --The O Gauge Railroading Primer, by Christopher Ritchie. Theres nothing inherently wrong with them, though I would shy away from the smaller transformers that are less than 75 watts, including the modern CW-40. We're sorry. My layout I am building is 5 sheets of 4x8 plywood and it will probaly take me 100 years to build it (I hope I have that much time left). Lionel Electric Toy Train Transformer Identification Guide RemembertheVeterans. Price Received. As cheap as the 1033 is, if youre going to buy a transformer, you might as well pay a few dollars more to get a 1033. A solid and stranded wire of the same gauge will be the same total diameter. The greatest transformer Lionel made in the postwar era was the 270 watt Lionel ZW. I think the RW is a bit better value, but that could just be timing. Note: if you proceed, you will no longer be following, $12.00 per 12 Months (plus tax if applicable). what size lionel transformer do i need. Classification/marker lights on the PRR steam engine, For Sale: Lionel 6-11127 Legacy Southern Pacific GS-4 Daylight, Lionel Bethlehem Steel slag car and ATLAS NYC Baggage car, Lionel O 2333790 TrainWorld & RBP Trains Chris Raines -Exclusive - Katy LEGACY ES44AC #2021, Converting MTH Rail king GS-4 PROTO 2 to ERR Cruise Commander, The Harpers Ferry Layout II - Backdrop panels completed. 7 Best Transformer For Model Railway - LEDS.CC Unlimited Members, sign in to enjoy sitewide access. Expanding the basic oval from the set is the quickest way to add more interest to your trains. Smaller feeder wires are used to bridge the small gap from the bus to the track. Ive talked more about the Lionel RW and the LW as well. As the train goes by, the door to the shed opens and a figure pops out, and once the train has passed the figure re-enters the building and the door shuts.